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News Update 11:00 PM

Posted January 1st, 2008 in Elections, Hubbub, News by M

Disturbing news from the Buru Buru area (thanks WathiiFM)

  • Paramilitary men are camping right outside gates
  • There is the modern equivalent of the Passover in operation. If your security lights are not on mobs will enter your house. Woe unto you if you and yours are there
  • Mobs have been forcefully circumcising people. Latest counts indicate about 20 people have suffered that fate. (NB circumcision is generally not practiced by the Luo community)
  • 5 people have bled to death after forceful circumcision

More news from the rest of Kenya

  • More about the burnt church in Eldoret. There are conflicting stories as to the number of people that were inside. Numbers are ranging from 50 to 250
  • Despite the government banning the rally on Thursday, the ODM insists it will go forward. I plan to be nowhere near Uhuru park. Mobs repulsed from rallies are generally not forgiving.
  • There is looming fuel shortage in most petrol stations in Nairobi
  • The unrest in Kenya is affecting Uganda as well. (Uganda, being landlocked, gets a lot of its supplies from Kenya). Fuel stations in Uganda are running out of fuel.
  • Goods are being held at the port at the request of buyers for fear that they will be looted/destroyed en route.
  • Kibaki still refuses to directly address the issue of insecurity. Sometimes silence speaks volumes
  • Samuel Kivuitu, ECK chairman has made some interesting comments on TV
    1. He was under intense pressure to make the announcement
    2. He contemplated resignation but felt that he would be perceived as a coward
    3. He claimed that the ECK had no legal standing to act on the objections of the political parties (Which I don’t buy, especially the discrepancy between results announced at constituency level and those at the KICC)
    4. He made an even more fascinating statement about presidency being very challenging, and then proceeding to say that the problem was some of the people around the presidency. He culminated by saying that some of the people around the presidency should never have been born
  • US Ambassador denies that the US had ever congratulated Kibaki for his victory. He clarified that what the US had congratulated were the Kenyan people.
  • So far the US, the EU and Australia have voiced concerns about the presidential poll results.

After21 
Neighbours gather to discuss the events

  • wathiifm

    Kivuitu’s statement leaves alot to be desired.

  • wathiifm

    SOURCE: STANDARD GROUP WEBSITE (http://eastandard.net/news/?id=1143979833)

    Kivuitu continued with his stunning revelations when he said he took the presidential election winner’s certificate to State House, Nairobi, after “some people threatened to collect it while I’m the one mandated by law to do so”.

    “I arrived at State House to take the certificate and I found the Chief Justice there, ready to swear-in Kibaki,” Kivuitu said.

    On claims that he was under undue pressure to declare results, Kivuitu said: “Some PNU (Party of National Unity) and ODM-Kenya leaders put me under pressure by calling me frequently, asking me to announce the results immediately”.

  • wathiifm

    it’s 3:00am and the paramillitary guys have just engaged themselves in a gun fight with some people.i cant see clearly but flashes of light are headed towards eastleigh

  • DG

    Now everyone tries to CYA. The American ambassadors speaking out of both sides of his mouth, it is despicable. He was in a position to persuade, but …. I really don’t know, he as the security…
    Kivuitu… someone who makes Neville Chamberlain look wonderful. A paper tiger. Thank you Mr. TR, you have began the honest look at our “winner takes all” corrupt political system”. I would say it goes further, we need to go back to 1969, and close the chapter, it is the seed to our troubles.

  • Wanjiru

    I hope Kenyans continue to fight for social justice. If they let Kibaki get away with this unquestionable type of rigging, they will never have a peaceful method of changing ineffective leaders because they will keep rigging the elections. We are with you in spirit and continue to hope that ALL countries will view Kibaki’s government as illegitimate until there is a transparent vote count! Thanks for this update, it helps to read something from the ground.

  • Laura

    Indeed tis a terrible state of affairs we are facing. I whole heartedly deplore the violence however I can identify with the pent up frustrations of the masses. After five years of watching the men in power lurching from one crisis to another, create one debacle after another, totally ignore the wishes of the majority as they pandered to the whims of the minority… many peace loving Kenyans clenched their fists, gritted their teeth and silently vowed to use the right channel, the vote, to send the bloody buggers to their Waterloo, but alas! even that has been denied to us. Early rise, hours and hours of peaceful queuing and then THIS?

    Honestly,this must be resolved if our faith is to be restored in the electrol process and if we are to draw a line under the era of the tyranny of the minority over the majority. WE deserve better. By any means necessary!In the interim violence must be eschewed at all cost however it is important that wananchi attend peaceful demonstrations to show their collective displeasure at this chiccanery…for starters.

  • Laura

    Someone correct me if I am wrong. Are these not Makerere products? Makerere be damned!

    Kivuiti’s recent comments have left me with a furrowed brow. I just finished a conversation with my brother in which I was telling him that Kivuiti seems to be sending out a desperate message in some of his statements/dodgy-oh-not-so-funny old-man-jokes.

    On one hand, he had clearly commented on the shenanigans, clearly voicing his concerns that there was “cooking” going on, in another instance he is purpoted to have handed over the certicate to Kibaki with words to these effect, ” Let me give it to you, before another fake president comes to claim it”. Emphasize on ANOTHER fake president. Question? Who was the first fake president? And then finally, he kept urging the dissenters to take their griveances to court. On the third issue I share Raila’s concern about the partiality of the Judiciary, however, if there is no requirement in the ECK legislation providing for investigation of any perceived dubious acts, such as those recently witnessed in the past election and there is a provision allowing for Judicial Review, then I believe the dissenters must endevour to follow this avenue if they are to obtain some semblance of redress.

    Call me naive, but ECK Commissioners have come out of the woodwork calling for Judicial Review as well, me thinks they might have some loaded arsenal with which to pelt this rogue regime and if their evidence is to be taken seriously it must be adduced in the right forum, otherwise it’s all going to be heresay. God help us all for these are trying times.

  • Grace

    This is a VERY important piece of information below. I think we now know what the two C-130’s that landed at Eldoret airport two days ago were carrying.

    There were carrying Karamajong.. the ones who are herding the 70,000 people into Burnt Forest and doing all the killing.

    Please see below…..

    A contingent of Karamojong guerrilla fighters are reported to have arrived in Eldoret town to join the struggle against Kibaki dictatorship. They are reported to have crossed Moi’s bridge to join forces fighting in the region.

    It is not yet clear how the guerrillas arrived in Eldoret but a source on the ground has told KSB that their arrival could signal the beginning of a guerrilla war-fare in Kenya to counter attacks by armed GSU forces which have been killing people.

    “People are getting frustrated and beginning to understand that on a long term, the anti-Kibaki war will not be fought with bare hands when security forces are armed”, said the source. “Security forces also need to begin dying and this will not happen with bare hands”, the source said.

    The guerrillas are reported to be remnants of the Shifta militia which were fighting the regime of former dictator Daniel arap Moi during the eighties. Others are believed to be hard-core members of the Karamojong who have been protecting cattle theft in the region after the government failed to provide protection.

    In North Eastern province, many pastoralists have stopped protecting their livestock with spears and arrows, choosing instead, to do so with AK 47 rifles. They changed tactics after armed bandits began killing people with automatic weapons then making away with large herds of cattle. In Kenya, the GSU are killing unarmed civilians following a “shoot to kill” order by Internal security chief John Michuki before being driven away in Land Rovers.

    Okoth Osewe

  • anotherM

    kenyans demonstrated on the streets of houston today. this was shown on two local stations. keep the international community informed. the local press also had the story from eldoret (chron.com). let the world know what’s going own before it becomes another rwanda. save kenya!

  • Mkenya

    Tafadhali lives are being lost……lets check our our stories before we publish them.

    For the record I loath what Kibaki has done but I am very concern with the casual way we are peddling alarming rumours.

    Please let call for non-violent civil resistance. Lets employ our mind on what best non-violent means can be used instead of peddling serious rumours that will further inflame the people

  • http://udi-m.blogspot.com udi

    I agree with Mkenya. Lets look for non-violent resistance. Kibaki cant govern if we give him hell. But he is ready to let Kenya turn into Rwanda since he will stash all his money abroad.

  • Daud

    So disappointed with some kenyans spreading rumours .It is as if they take a morbid pleasure in seeing all this destruction. So sad. Kenya will never be the same.

  • dead jamhuri

    The agikuyu have no beef with with the LUHYA, Kisii. Never had and never we shall nevr will.

  • contact
  • brainz

    we all need to attend the rally on Thursday to protest for democracy.

    PEACEFULL MASS ACTION WASEEEEEE!!!!!!!

  • Half n Half

    @brainz: I doubt it will be peaceful!

    @ Grace: Really ama it is just more rumors to inflame tempers? I have been previously told to check the author in order to place the thoughts!

    I am getting more and more frustrated as the days go by. I am beginning to look at people *shingo upande* what with the neighbours we used to “borrow sugar” from suddenly becoming the enemy! seriously someone has to answer for this.

    There is an email going round the internet which frankly speaking is the scariest email I have ever seen and I REFUSE to forward it to anyone and have written to those forwarding it to me to tell them that I have blocked their email addresses. I find it despicable that mature intelligent (or so I thought) people can send /condone such mail. People let us stop the hate

  • http://www.africanews.com AfricaNews

    Pictures of the streets of Kisumu:
    http://www.africanews.com/site/list_messages/14279

    Video of the police walking in the streets of Nairobi:
    http://www.africanews.com/site/list_messages/14267

  • http://Seasonsandreasons.wordpress.com Seasonsandreasons

    Am sitting in my office and reading this and wondering where all these alarmist messages are coming from.

    Lets face it, unless someone is looking for trouble, going for the rally tomorrow is suicide. Do we think Raila or Kibaki care whether we live or died? If they did, they would be taking care of their utterances. Lets face it, it is the common man who keeps dying for the power hungry.

    @Brainz, Lets face it, you will be on the internet getting news like the rest of us tomorrow and will not be near Uhuru park.

  • Tony

    Let’s face it, what’s happened has happened/ is happening…we’ve vented, expressed our disappointment and concerns and now its time to put all that aside and start birthing viable solutions…

    Here’s mine:

    1. Mr. Kibaki, should initiate the call for a recount and set the neccessary procedures in motion to ensure a fair, transparent recount in ALL 210 constituentcies(sp)

    2. Mr. Odinga, should call off the rally tomorrow because nothing good could possibly come out of it. Unless you have been living under a rock for the past 10-15 years, you know that opposition rallies in Uhuru park and Kamkunji have only served to increase the body count.

    3. Lastly and more importantly, both leaders should put their egos and myopic visions aside for a minute and JOINTLY address the nation.

    Its not the gospel, just my opinion.

  • http://toiyoi.wordpress.com toiyoi

    Lets us think long term people
    “A house divide dagainst itself cannot stand.” Kenya is already divided. Why the pretense? It can not stand. Christ told us so, History tells us so.

    Lets formalize the divisions. Lets us take advantage of this election ( which has shown who wants what) and undo the injustice the British did. Let us divide the nation. There need not be a war in doing this ( hopefully ).

    Why force the GEMA people to be in one country with the rest of Kenyans if they do not want to? And why force the others to be in one kenya with the GEMA if they feel they are being trodden under?

    Anyone who attacks what i am saying is either:
    -living in a bubble
    -having false hopes of unity
    -is not honest about the real-life situation in kenya (and ALL of africa for that matter)
    -is among the new rich and thus have a lot to lose
    - is burying his head int he sad as to what is really wrong with Africa

  • abelian

    Toiyoi:

    Yeah and the sabaot and Luhyas, the Coastals vs Baras ( Likoni), Turkana vs Rendille vs Borans. Why pick on one community just because they did not vote the way you wanted them to?

    The only way Kenya will survive is when all these tribal nonsense is crushed, perhaps in my children’s times, perhaps never.

  • Tony

    @toiyoi

    With all due respect, dividing Kenya along tribal lines is not what I would call a logical solution. And no, I do not live a bubble or have any false hopes of unity.

    Onyango, Kiplagat, Mwangi, Kerubo have been peacefully living side by side for decades so what you’re proposing makes little sense. It is the political elite who have issues with each others tribe and they want to pass on their misinformed opinions to the regular folk.

    There used to be a way to peacefully get rid of all the politicians that were no good for the country. It was called Elections but now I dont know.

  • http://toiyoi.wordpress.com toiyoi

    You guys refuse to think, why?
    I supposed you were taught history. How did kenya come about? How did the african nations come to be? Yeah, “divide and rule”. The british learnt their European history well. They understood well that: A house divided against itself can not stand.

    Why are african countries generally unable to move forward 40 years since “independece”? Resources? Manpower?

    The first step that ought to have been undertaken in 1963 was to seek a solution that recognizes the different “peoples” that made up “Kenya”. It was not done. I say, do it now, or postpone it. Now it can be done without war, in that the people have spoken their minds in this election as to where they want to be.

    For example, do you really believe that the rwanda problem has been solved? Why do you think the Serbians/Kosovans wanted a split 1000 years after “they did this to us”.

    @Tony The “Onyango, Kiplagat, Mwangi, Kerubo have been peacefully living side by side for decades”. Forced by circumstances, yet always suspicious of one another. Onyango thinking “Mwangi is favored” Mwangi thinking “Onyango is lazy will never rule over me”. You know this. Maybe in your elite circles, where resources is not an issue (e.g. you have the time to blog at such a time), you have the luxury to think on such terms.

    @abelian
    if the 43 peoples decide to all go their separate ways, despite the clear evidence that they need to be united in a bigger “country” to survive. So be it. Let them learn from experience and latter seek unity.

    Think long term, not band-aid solutions.

    We are many nations, not one nation. If we could somehow learn that despite the many nations in kenya we can put structures that enable true unity, we would survive, but we have not.

  • abelian

    Toiyoi:

    Your original contention was the GEMA should go their separate ways and leave the rest of Kenyans to go on with their lives. What I find amazing is that no one said the same to the Kales for the 20 years of Moi’s rule!

    I and many people I know refuse to be tribalists, for 40 years tribalism has been shamelessly used as a tool for oppression and gaining wealth. We have to crush that!!

    Any half-brained moron can see there is no way we can have 43 tiny nations in the area size of Kenya and if you think that will create your tribal Utopia then you need to look again. Even before the coming of the Europeans Kenyan tribes still fought and killed each other over land, pastures or watering holes

  • Tony

    Toiyoi:

    So the colonialists came to Africa and did this and that etc…tough, but we have to move on…Reflect on history, dont dwell in it…Dont get me wrong, I’m not downplaying the adverse effects of colonialism, just saying we should pick up the pieces and move on…

    When thinking about our country’s future, try and adopt a 360 degree view of what is at stake…43 different nations in the area that is now Kenya, makes NO economic sense at all…The folks in and around the urban areas get richer because now they dont have to split revenue with the poorer parts of the country and the poorer get poorer because of the same…

    so now Onyango hates Kerubo even more and so on and so forth….

    And bringinig Serbia and Kosovo into this is a clear indication that quite frankly, you’re biting off more than you can chew…

  • http://toiyoi.wordpress.com toiyoi

    @abelian
    I used GEMA as an example

    That “Any half-brained moron can see there is no way we can have 43 tiny nations in the area size of Kenya and if you think that will create your tribal Utopia then you need to look again.”

    Of course they can not survive as separate entities, and that is what i mean by saying “if the 43 peoples decide to all go their separate ways, despite the clear evidence that they need to be united in a bigger “country” to survive. So be it. Let them learn from experience and latter seek unity.”

    Hear what you are saying “I and many people I know refuse to be tribalists, for 40 years tribalism has been shamelessly used as a tool for oppression and gaining wealth. We have to crush that!!”

    We all want that. We have not crushed it these past 40 years. How do you propose to do it in 2008? Imagine the folly of doing the same thing all over again and expecting different results. Pray tell, how do you propose to do it? Tanzania way? Libya way? How, abelian?

  • http://toiyoi.wordpress.com toiyoi

    @Tony
    On colonialist: all i am saying is “learn from them”, not blame them. What do we learn? That a house divide against itself cannot stand.

    On “43 different nations in the area that is now Kenya, makes NO economic sense at all”.

    True, that is why i wrote that “if the 43 peoples decide to all go their separate ways, despite the clear evidence that they need to be united in a bigger “country” to survive. So be it. Let them learn from experience and latter seek unity.”. In other words, it only have the 43 nations have realised life is tough being alone (experience) that Kerubo will tell Onyango and Koech, “hey, we need each other. Lets come together and agree to govern ourselves in this and that fashion”. That was never done in 1963 and is the cause of these problems.

    Are you not understanding me? How do you propose to solve the animosity that exists? Ignore it and say “hey, look, we are all brothers, we have lived together in peace, let us continue living in peace”? Why are European generally stable? Why do they now seek unity as EU? Why did USSR collapse? Re-read your history.

  • http://mywordsonly.blogspot.com acolyte

    This is a sad sad state of affairs to say the least. Kibaki’s impression of an ostrich is doing nothing for the country. He wanted power by all means and he now has it, he should use it to ask for peace and calm.
    I do hope that story of Karamajong fighters being brought in is a rumour and remains that. Civil war has nothing to offer Kenya or anyone in that matter.
    At the end of the day we must have one Kenya, all this talk of seccesion is rubbish and should be forgotten. Now just to get both parties to the table…..

  • Wambui

    New Year’s Day 2008 was probably the worst day of my life as it is the day I truly believed I was speaking to my grandmother, mother, uncles and aunts for the last time.

    You see, they live in Eldoret and have done so for four generations. My grandfather built Harambee Secondary School for ALL the Kenyans living in Eldoret (and was on the board of directors till he passed away), he built St. Mary’s Yamumbi Church for ALL the Kenyans living in Yamumbi and he donated the land on which St. Mary’s Hospital now sits. And I know he wasn’t thinking about the ‘tribe’ of the people who would went there to pray or to the hospital for medical attention.

    I remember going with my grandfather to visit Sister Juliana (the Nigerian nun who runs the hospital) and hearing the patients of all tribes thanking him for what he had done. He was a wonderful, wonderful, wonderful man and I grew up with many, many people of other tribes in his house. In fact, we have a Luo ‘brother’ who lived with us while he was at the seminary in Eldoret and is now a priest. While he lived with us, Fatehr Opondo was clothed and fed by my grandparents.

    In 1992, my granfather and grandmother were attacked during the so-called ‘tribal clashes’. My aunt was raped in front of my uncle and my cousin Danny was killed in Kitale when he went to pick up his car.

    A few days ago, as I talked on the phone with my family, I really believed I would never see them again. Three of my uncles and my little cousin were holed up in the SDA church at Small Town waiting for their death. The rest of my family was in hiding in my uncle’s house nearby.

    When they heard about the Huruma church burning, the SDA Church people took my uncles and cousins out of the church and hid them in a small garage, told them to turn their phones off and not make a sound.

    A few hours later, a horde of murderers appeared and threatened the SDA church officials with death. They said they knew they were hiding my uncles and others nearby and that if they (the SDA) did not produce them, they would burn everything down.

    Thank god, thank god that those men and women stood firm because my uncles and cousin are alive today.

    As for the horde, they went off and burnt down my Uncle Kamau’s house and every other Kikuyu’s home in the area.

    So people, please tell me:

    How are we supposed to feel? What are we supposed to think? Who can convince us that this murder and pillage were unplanned? That is was just a ‘spontaneous’ reaction?

    And the funny thing is, I don’t even hate the marauders. I couldn’t care less about the properties they burnt down. All I am is tired of Kenya, Kenyans and being Kenyan.

    Listen to me:

    We are sick and tired of being blamed for everything. We are sick and tired of being the targets of other people’s spiritual illnesses. We are fed up.

    When you people are busy wailing and shedding tears for Democracy, could you please shed a tear for we Kikuyu’s who are sick and tired of being turned upon every time things don’t go somebody’s way? Could you please shed a tear for those families that weren’t able to escape, unlike mine? All my neighbours who are dead?

    What the hell is wrong with you Kenyans?

  • abelian

    Wambui,

    I feel you and I hope your family will be well and safe…

  • Mutumia

    This is a sad, sad time for Kenya and Kenyans. I am praying for peace and that sanity and cool heads prevail. 200+ people dead is 200+ people too many.
    Remember, we are all Kenyans and tomorrow, after the looting and the burning and the raping and the violence, we are the same people who will have to pick up the pieces and live with each other.

  • abelian

    @toiyoi,

    You of course know that the Maasai have been having clan skirmishes, kicking out GEMA and Kisii from Narok will not create a peaceful Maasaistan…

    People will start fighting clan against clan and after that family vs family…

    Relenting to the primitive tribal urge to go your separate way is not a solution and you know it! We can always start afresh and correct our previous mistakes

  • Tony

    Toiyoi:

    I hear what you’re saying and I understand what you mean. True, we have to find a way to deal with the ’43 differences’. Splitting them so that they can learn from experience would probably help but I dont think its in everyone’s best intrest. Why postpone peace when you can have it now?

    We have to make a choice, western style democracy or the dilution (not eradication) of our African tribal roots and culture. I know, I know it sounds appalling but if you take a second to think about it you’ll understand.

    Limited resources coupled with strong tribal alliegances especially when they exist in different proportions is NOT a good recipe for democracy.

    When a son is born to Samburu parents, why not name him Olekuyiot Otieno Kamau. And if a girl is born to Luhya parents, why not name her Adijah Kerubo Anyango. Teach them, their history so that their ancestry is only known to them and those that care to find out.

    And then no one ever has to worry about tribal discrimination.

  • Tony

    If I had the power, I would introduce legislation that required parents to have their childrens names come from at least two/three different Kenyan tribes before they are issued with a birth certificate.

    For example : Omondi Cheruyoit Isustsa

    No restrictions on what tribe you choose

  • http://toiyoi.wordpress.com toiyoi

    @ableian
    I know abelian, i know and it saddens me beyond words. That is why i am thinking of permanent solutions that should last 100 years. Do you think these GEMA and Gussis and Luos being chased by the Maasai will forgive the Maasai and forget?

    What do you propose?

    You know what we really ought to call for now (despite its potential backfiring on us)? Since Michuki and Kibaki and ODM are not willing to end this ( Michuki and karume esp, since they have the big guns ), perhaps the military should step in and bring an end to all all the madness. After .5/1/2/3 years, maybe another election can be held.

    But i will be honest; This is my suggestion, ( not that anybody cares). If i were the military top brass, i would soon after seek to split up the country, at least into two, based on the election results and have a referendum asking folks where they wanna be. Let people make the choice.

    That will work. People’s eyes will be opened and Realignments can happen after that.

    Abelian, suggests to me a better solution. This idea of talk talk talk, will not take away the animosity that has been created.

  • abelian

    toiyoi:

    I am despairing Toiyoi…

    I am at loss at the moment, but somehow we have to solve this recurring land problem. The Africans are too attached to land such that they are willing to kill or be killed for a fistful of dirt.

    I am bitterly disappointed by Kibaki’s admni, these people are just quiet while Kenya burns and the only voice we get to hear is that one of Mutua. Kibaki may have to realize irregardless of what happened with the results, he cannot be a proper president and things will not solve themselves …

    I despair Toiyoi… I am having a miserable new year and I am hitting the bottle too often

  • Tony

    Toiyoi:

    You’re half right on the military invention idea. Unfortunately, the two men that could end this have bigger egos than brains. Theoretically now might be the time for patriots in the armed forces to act. BUT and that’s a big BUT…

    ..power corrupts even the best of them. I fear what could happen if a military general took over and hang on for the long term…

    the other factor, is logistics…I’m not sure if there’s enough armed forces personnel to run and police the country…

    other than that, yes that could be another option

  • http://n/a Dan

    @ Wambui i feel nothing for you yes they died but have you asked yourself why they died. I find it hard for a sane person to take another’s life but this was gonna happen sooner or later.

    Am neither of the warring tribes but for long i’ve heard of other Kenyan’s being put down by others.”I’ll never let an un-circumsised man rule me” aren’t we all Kenyans? What gives YOU the right to rule over me and put down another? Do you own the country?

    If you haven’t noticed,the “clashes” are all over Kenya and you know whats funny? All the action is concentrated on one tribe hmmmmmm i wonder what could have caused that…….wake up and smell the coffee!

    Kenyans are tired of the same ‘ol shit happening over and over again we are looking for change REAL change. Biwotts crib was torched and so was Moi’s.Not all Kalez were eating when Mo 1 was in power thank god they had an independent way of thought and showed those idiots what they thought of them!

    This is the time to sit down and settle our differences. Sweeping dust under the carpet is not gonna help.Kenya belongs to all of us!

  • http://toiyoi.wordpress.com toiyoi

    @tony
    I like the suggestion of naming. In addition, we MUST abolish all languages, so you can never really tell ( unless of course you drop someone’s pants, but this could be addressed).

    Language and culture- we are fond of them, but are they too precious to give up for the sake of life? And anyway, we conduct all our important commerce/communications in swahili/english. Must we hang on to kikuyu/luo/kalenjin languages?

    @ablelian
    You should know i have spent sleepness nights worrying about the safety of my relatives spread all over kenya. But take it easy on the bottle, pray instead and say, from the heart: “Jesus Christ, come to my aid, also protect my people”. Believe me that works always.

    @Dan
    You are a beast. There is a time to hate and a time to console. This is a time to console Wambui

  • Frun

    Toiyoi,

    Are you suggesting that all men should be forcefully circumcised? You and Tony’s suggestions are fascist and frightening.

    Tribalism needs to be fought against, I agree. But you don’t replace tribalism with fascism. That’s wrong. People should be free to name their children and no one should be forced to be circumcised. Wrong, wrong, wrong.

  • http://toiyoi.wordpress.com toiyoi

    @Frun
    that all be cut: of course not, even Americans and Jews are turning away from it. I am thinking ahead: if you are done abolishing names and language, the only other distinguiser would be the cut. That is what i meant.

    On abolishing culture: if you have a life and death choice as we now have, would rather have culture( what is that anyway? ) or life? E.g. Americans, are culture-less, but look how we drool at their articles of “progress”.

    Do not just say tribalism needs to fought, explain how? Who should fight it, how?

    I am calling for military intervention in Kenya (and yes, i know i need to be careful what i wish for). That is the only way out now.

  • Frun

    @toiyoi

    Oh ok, I’m glad you weren’t advocating that. I’m by no means a fan of tribalism, but I don’t the names themselves are the problem. It’s rather people’s perceptions and attitudes about them that need to change. Tribalism should be fought much in the same way racism was fought. Make it illegal to discriminate on the basis of tribe/ethnicity, enforce these laws. Military intervention cannot solve a social problem. And I disagree that Americans are cultureless. Other countries complain all the time about how American culture is infiltrating their own and diluting it.

    The same way the US has tried to force Iraqis to get along with military force and it hasn’t worked.

  • http://toiyoi.wordpress.com toiyoi

    Racism: are you suggesting that racism is no longer an issue in America? Where?

    Tribalism in kenya: if you have laws, who will follow or enforce them? See, even our President is stealing an election in broad daylight. How can he enforce any other law?

    Why Military solution: Force is needed. See here for the complete picture and my suggested solution: http://toiyoi.wordpress.com

  • alex

    my dad once told me that the worst civilian government is better than the best military government. Kibaki is stealing votes to retain power. imagine what a general would do with the army, police and GSU. the Kenya we know, will surely die.

  • http://chrenyan.wordpress.com/ Chrenyan

    @Wambui

    It’s a long time since I commented, but that is a sad, sad tale. My condolences. Like Philip Ochieng’, while I can understand people’s anger inasmuch as it is connected to election results, this violence cannot be condoned.

    I’m so so sorry Wambui. Let Kenyans stop this madness. I hope your family will continue to be safe. More, may they be able to forgive and forget. Unrelenting bitterness will only result in festering, pus-filled wounds in the soul that will never heal. Being unable to forgive someone represents that person’s victory over you – the time, energy spent trying thinking how bad they are, and finding ways to strike back. Forgiveness is actually victory – victory and freedom. Victory over yourself, and then over your antagonist.

    Let me add that for the first time, I’m impressed with the role of a church in the matter. God bless those kindly SDA souls that saved your families lives. In any story of conflict, heroes emerge. May we all use this example of living above tribe to live above tribe ourselves.

    It will start with you and me.

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